Wanna get a new trackball, but I'm currently stuck between the Huge and the Ploopy. Anyone used both and can compare?
A bit benefit of the ploopy is QMK, but then elecom apparently does have direct support in linux for remapping the buttons through xinput.
poopie
I have the elecom so if you have any question in particular I can give you my feedback. For example
>apparently does have direct support in linux for remapping the buttons through xinput.
I can confirm. I use Fn2 to scroll pages using the much more practical ball instead of the wheel.
Left click, right click and Fn3 have decent quality switches (I don't remember their name anymore). Every other button is cheaper. Fn1 and Fn2, for example, are shitty quality pic related. In the long run my Fn1 kinda broke (it often fails to click) and I still need to replace it.
>I can confirm
Neat, does scroll tilt also work well on linux?
>shitty switches
Do you own any other elecom trackballs by any chance? I have the deft and the deft pro. Some of their fn switches I could see being subpar, but so far none have actually failed to click for me. If you happen to have or have ever had a deft, it'd be interesting to compare and see if elecom is doing the same thing on all its trackballs, or if the huge has some particularly shitty switches.
So far with the button mapping resolved I'm leaning towards the elecom, just to have a smooth molded surface rather than using a 3d printed DIY shell, even though I think the ploopy has better switches.
I'd be interested in hearing from anyone who's tried the bearing-based ball on the ploopy, though.
If elecom trackballs were so good that would be no need for Ploopy to exist. Go ploopy.
What's the different with this one
I'm surprised people still use trackballs. They have very poor ergonomics - either you're putting a ton of stress on your had crabbing your fingers to roll the ball if on top, or overworking your thumb joint to roll the ball if it's on the side.
Trackballs should be limited to instances where you actually need to replicate the feel and inertia of rolling a ball.
Honestly I've been using the MX Ergo for about 6 months now and I vastly prefer it for working/office tasks over my mouse. There's some thumb fatigue for sure but it feels like I'm doing less physical work than moving the mouse around my entire desk.
I have one of these actually. I find the ergonomics weird: elecom and modern logitech trackballs kinda mimic mouse ergonomics, where the device goes into the cup of your hand. This one, and many other older-style trackballs, I just don't quite get.
The idea, I believe, is that you just rest your hand above it. However, the incline is absolutely inane. For me, it forces me to bend my wrist upwards, which is atrocious for the joint. The alternative is to float my entire arm and hand above it, which is not only tiring, but more importantly not very viable for stability: sure I can float my wrists while typing for the sake of ergonomics, but not while trying to carefully maneuvre the large ball around to finely control my pointer.
For me, it would have honestly made more sense to angle it the opposite way, away from you. Even so, I'm not a fan of the flat shape as opposed to the "in-hand" shape of other modern trackballs.
One thing I can praise is its construction and general ball. Some people say the scroll ring is scratch but I didn't have that problem. I'd honestly love to use it more, but I simply can'd do so comfortably.
(Also, the sensor placement under the ball is different to the elecoms, so the motion of the pointer during fine rotations of the ball does not behave the same way, throwing off my muscle memory. But that's a me problem, and also if it was actually comfortable to use I could easily re-learn that.)
Not a convincing argument. One reason for Ploopy to exist is reddit karma: take a look at the mechanical keyboard """"communities"""", and for every actually good novel keyboard design, there's a dozen others which bring absolutely no improvements to the table, or often are objectively worse than other existing keyboards regardless of your preferences, but either get upvoted as a "cool project" or have cool looks or something bringing in fans. Popularity-chasing is combined with Not-Invented-Here syndrome so everyone tries to make their own project. The Ploopy is born from the exact same community.
Of course that doesn't mean the Ploopy ISN'T good. There are tons of useless projects, but there are also many good ones that actually do improve on the status quo. It just means you have to judge critically.
So what does Ploopy bring to the table? Right off the bat I can see two "selling points": open hardware/design, and QMK compatibility. I can see those alone being reasons to launch the project: open hardware is a nice philosophy, and QMK is a pretty nice firmware.
Unfortunately if these are the only advantages Ploopy has, for me personally that's not enough to convince me to pay 2.5x as much for a 3D-printed DIY kit. I'm glad it exists and I might have even picked one up just as a curiosity if I had the time to tinker with it, but I have no qualms using "closed hardware" for practical things and elecom buttons' in-OS customisation will suit me just fine.
If you're crabbing your fingers you're doing it wrong.
In any case I'd much rather work out my fingers than stress my wrist. inb4 "move ur arm": that's both way more tiring than either of the above, and also ends up messing with your posting. A trackball I can position in the perfect position for my shoulder width, screen and keyboard, and keep it there, thus keeping my posture correct.
But using two or three fingers on the ball lets you move it around quite conveniently without needing to stress them that much. Typing on qwerty probably causes much more finger fatigue than using a trackball.
>Neat, does scroll tilt also work well on linux?
No issues with the trackball functionality. Every button works and it is configurable. At least in xorg, I can't tell about wayland.
>Some of their fn switches I could see being subpar, but so far none have actually failed to click for me.
I never used any other trackball and I don't have any other elecom device. I suspect your subpar switches are the same subpar buttons in the huge: it's a shitty push button and if you disassemble your device you can very clearly see the difference between real switches and those things. It failed on me because I was frequently hitting Fn1... and because it's just a shitty push button.
>just to have a smooth molded surface rather than using a 3d printed DIY shell, even though I think the ploopy has better switches.
The spongy thing can get a little bit consumed after few years, it doesn't stay brand new looking forever, but I don't have any major complaints about it. That said, the ploopy shell looks like an embarrassing piece of garbage in comparison.
By the way, go wireless without a doubt. The batteries holds for a very long time even if you keep it on 24h a day. I think I change batteries like 3 times a year or something and I pretty much never turn it off.
They are super comfy if you use your laptop on the couch. Much better than my shitty touchpad. If you have a macbook or a desktop maybe you wouldn't care.
>the ploopy shell looks like an embarrassing piece of garbage in comparison.
I mean, it is a hobbyist DIY piece, not mass-produced anywhere. Normally I wouldn't mind, e.g. in a keyboard shell for example. But what puts me off is that that's supposed to be where you rest your entire hand.
>By the way, go wireless without a doubt.
Yep, this does match my experience with other elecom products.
Jap consumer electronics are weird. They tend to get some aspects incredibly right (like the battery management, and honestly the design/shape/concepts of their trackballs) and at the same time cheap out or drop the ball on seemingly trivial stuff (like using three extra $0.10 switches instead of $0.02 switches).
I have a Huge and I find the ergonomics of it to be just fine. However the build quality isn't perfect; on mine the rubber textured ring on the scroll wheel is sort of oblong, and so it would rub against the scroll wheel housing halfway through a rotation and made it feel weird. I solved it by filing down some of the plastic where the rubber was rubbing. Still, it's nicer to use than
which I had for years. The Kensington is an ergonomic nightmare and most of them have a factory hardware defect that causes the scroll wheel to become erratic and eventually stop working completely.
huge poopie lol
>overworking your thumb
no more than you are when you stroke your dick, friend
but seriously, have used a thumbball for more than a decade with zero issues
yeah the slope is dogshit, but ive managed to find a comfy way to use it
you can get the slimblade which is probably a little better but not wireless (i kinda wanted a wireless one which is why i got the expert)
there's also an orbit wireless available now, i've tried both and the orbit felt more comfy, but i need more than 2 buttons for comfy browsing (which they could easily add)
anyway im happy with the expert, ive had it for about 3 years
Yeah that looks neat, but it feels like your posture is an ugly hack to try to make the best of the flat shape - you're literally holding it "mouse-style" except kinda floating and half your hand is on the trackball and half is off it and resting on your table. Like, I'm not sure if elecom does left-handed variants, but there's a left-handed ploopy which feels like it'd fit in your hand much better. (Not saying you should get one, just thinking aloud about the shapes.)
I genuinely don't understand this design philosophy in trackballs. It's not like it's the only one of its kind, either - so many of the older models are like this (with a few exceptions, like a couple of the microsoft ones).
I bought an Elecom deft pro once and the ball was sticking. Is there a break-in period for them? The ergo is really good. My MX Ergo is getting pretty ratty and I've replaced the double-clicking switch once already.
so a vertical mouse is the final pill ?