My understanding of the basic argument of land back leftists is that as the Americas were conquered by Europeans and taken from the American Indian the American Indian as such as rights to the whole of North America.
The American Indian however prior to the invasion of the white man engaged in numerous (often genocidal) wars of conquest against one and other.
To keep this brief, why do these conquests and genocides not delegitimize the rights of the American Indian the same way they do the European colonizers?
To give the Left a chance to respond, i genuinely do want to know how this is not itself a racially essentializing and contradictory ideology.
I’ve literally never seen a serious answer to this before
Do any exist??
Honest Question for “Land Back” Leftists
Adrian Young
William Cox
They just hate White people. There's literally nothing else to the leftist mindset
Christian Lewis
fpbp
Josiah Ortiz
>"Land Back" Leftists
you mean 'blood and soil' leftists? people who think indians have an hereditary, racial claim on the entirety of the united states?
as with most such subhumans they are either sockpuppets for communists or sockpuppets for minority identitarians. for the love of god stop speaking to these people as though they have thoughts of their own, if you want to argue with them go straight to the source.
they don't hear what you say until their handlers hear it first.
Gabriel Martin
>To keep this brief, why do these conquests and genocides not delegitimize the rights of the American Indian the same way they do the European colonizers?
quite, simply: special pleading. they create a special category (non-white) and project its specialness onto history. i have attempted to remove the brain worms from some of these, and it is bad. they are so prejudiced against whites, they cannot even see their own hypocrisy. for example, i talked to one who claimed "white people just dont understand some things because they didnt go through them." this was in the context of me critiquing white priviledge. i construct a simple argument showing that if we simply reverse the roles, she would take umbrage with the formation, meaning, if my argument was "non-whites just dont understand white things like civilization for example," she could not see how the logic she was employing was the same as she accused her "oppressors" of employing, and she simply dismissed my analogy and said "but it's different."
they just hate white people due to jealousy, and they compensate by creating an elaborate "intellectual justification" for their stark, naked hatred. it was more important for this girl to believe she was a victim than to practice consistent thinking or logic.
Ian Brooks
Xavier Fisher
Is this seriously the only responses to be had??
Reactionaries mocking the leftist position for being disingenuous and bad faith???
Is there literally not a single leftist on board willing to put forward their argument????
Gabriel Lewis
Is there literally nothing more then THIS???
Not a SINGLE Leftist willing (or able) to defend their ideology??
Cameron Walker
Stop thinking they care one iota about hypocrisy.
Hypocrisy is an educated, logical, white man's concept. When you try and apply it to neoleftists, or jews, or blacks, you are only proving yourself stupid. It's like wondering why a crazy person doesn't do things in a way that makes sense to you - they are insane. There is nothing more that needs to be said, because your mind and theirs don't function the same way. At all.
I cringe when people, cuckservatives for example, say "if the roles were reversed..." It doesn't make sense. They will never see hypocrisy as something that should be avoided.
Michael Garcia
that's why i came to Any Forums. i was tired of being called "a white guy" in leftist spaces. after a few months i realized communism was bullshit and these brain worm ridden identitarians are just the nu janissaries of the emptre, even though they pretend to be "anti fascist." it makes me sick how disconnected from reality they are. I spent so much time and energy trying to "be an ally," to people that just simply hate me. i am a foolish man.
Austin White
you are right. i have made the argument "you cannot reason with a pitbull," to describe the condition of most people as "beyond assailibility of arguments," meaning their positions are beyond rationality
Jaxon Young
Nomads have no territory besides whatever clay they occupy at the time. No borders.
Arguments can be made that they suffered cultural damage from being forcibly integrated, but this was a brand new process and nobody knew how stupid the common chug really was.
As always, those who have been directly grievanced have the rest of their lives to seek restitution. When they and the ones at direct fault, there's no point in continuing. Nobody has the right to take up the cause of a lazy fucking loser.
Ryder Bailey
>they are the new janasaries of the empire
I mean yeah I guess but fucking janasaries could at least give a reason for the legitimacy of their empire (in the case of the Spanish conversion to their god, in the case of the British the process of “civilizing”)
But these people don’t even know WHAT they believe in unironically
Their is no actual text apparently
(At least not one any number of them know)
> I spent so much time and energy trying to "be an ally," to people that just simply hate me. i am a foolish man.
Anything more you want to tell about your story friend??
It’s interesting
Isaiah Myers
> Nomads have no territory besides whatever clay they occupy at the time.
>No borders.
So if I’m understanding this right (and feel free to correct me if I am wrong as I don’t want to strawman this) the argument is essentially that as the way of life of the American Indian was destroyed this constitutes a greater crime then the destruction of native peoples by other native peoples and as such reduces the rights of the European in regard to land ownership??
Seems like a rather reactionary argument frankly; Ted kazinski shit.
But it’s not like any of these leftists coherently keep to this ideology tho. Most are outright in favor of destroying previous cultural structure in the name of adopting more
>>>””progressive”
Ways of being both in and outside the west.
Even those sqweemish about neo-con wars of liberal imperialism STILL want nations like Afghanistan to ultimately embrace shit like
>”feminism”
How do they reconcile this??
Dominic Gray
You forget that the mestizos have somehow convinced themselves that because they are some part aztec, or whatever brand native you desire, they are also entitled to this land. In Chicano studies currently, forced to take diversity classes at college, and its always “the anglos stole this land from 80,000 mestizos (hispanic pop from Texas to Cali in 1836-1850).” Mind you they had this land for over 300 years and did fuck all with it. Then they bitch that “over 100 hispanics were lynched.” I’m sorry did you fools forget about the 80 million natives and slaves that you killed in the Viceroyalty of Peru alone? Hypocritical cunts.
Thomas Young
my breaking point was when i was talking to a black girl working at a smoothie store. she had a communist tattoo so i assumed that meant we could have a conversation about communism and how capitalism is evil etcetera. after five minutes, she looks at me dead serious, and says "you're racist." i was taken aback. what do you mean? i asked her. she said "all white people are inherently racist." i said do you think the fact that i am standing here talking to you about communism and the evil system indicates that i am a racist? she doubled down and looked at me flatly and said in a cold monotone voice, "yes, all white people are inherently racist." i left the store completely shocked by this experience. you might be right on the janissary part, i just assumed it to mean a person who would willingly serve an evil despot just because they get a benefit from it (shelter, money, prestige etc). i had another experience sort of similar where a retired black lady officer from the air force in her forties claimed i as a white male earning minimum wage at the hotel she was temporarily living at to conveniently collect her car registration mail, was "more priviliedged" than her, and "some things white people will never understand." she claimed that she was oppressed by racism even though she gets a several thousand dollar pension check deposited into her bank account every month at the courtesy of the taxpayers of the "racist white supremacist united states." i was baffled by how this person convinced themselves of the most asinine shit, but it makes sense in the context of what the other user stated about them not caring about rationality or proper thinking or argumentation, but rather they abuse and use everything around them as a means to their perverted ends.
Jace Wood
Leftism cannot survive in an environment which allows scrutiny.
Samuel Rivera
It's not mockery, it's the truth. The only belief a leftist has is hatred of White people. All of the contradictions in their worldview can be justified by this
Dominic Watson
Both sides were bad and 1 had to win. Numerous treaties were signed and one side always broke the no violence clauses so fights would start. Massacres were common by Indians murdering hundreds of women and kids on the frontier. They were savage. In some books even the Indians couldn't look at how lustful their people were about killing. Empathy was not a common trait. The white man knew this and would retaliate without hesitation and were more successful. Yeah the Indians got jewed out of their lands but they also got liquor and guns for it. What would the Indians do with their lands back? Replace McDonald's with casinos on each corner. Liquor stores instead of Starbucks.
Jayden Kelly
Exactly. That's why I don't ever deal in nerd logic, and just carry a small hatchet for debating.
Xavier Ross
Let's refight the war. This time take no prisoners. Nobody left alive means nobody left to whine.
Dylan Powell
Fucking Cope. You Americans traitors stole that land of Britain now all your descendents will burn in hell.
Connor Jenkins
Please forgive us govenah we can change I promise.
Wyatt Jones
> 80 million natives and slaves that you killed in the Viceroyalty of Peru alone?
Do you have any links for this bro?
I’d like to read more
> my breaking point was when i was talking to a black girl working at a smoothie store. she had a communist tattoo so i assumed that meant we could have a conversation about communism and how capitalism is evil etcetera. after five minutes, she looks at me dead serious, and says "you're racist." i was taken aback. what do you mean? i asked her. she said "all white people are inherently racist." i said do you think the fact that i am standing here talking to you about communism and the evil system indicates that i am a racist? she doubled down and looked at me flatly and said in a cold monotone voice, "yes, all white people are inherently racist."
Yeah I saw alot of this shir at university itself, probably more then I would of if I, like most of my friends, didn’t do the reading or talk in class.
At the end of the day I think it may just come down to the left believing on some ontological level that white people (as at least a concept of not an ethnicity) “hold humanity back” in some sort of I’ll defined yet deeply apparent way; backwards justified to explain the third worldist thesis that revolution in the first world is impossible.
In short they don’t think any aspect of the modern world (or history) is meaningfully a product of natur but in virtually all cases the result of human beings consciously CHOOSING to believe in various “social constructs”
(Choosing to believe in the “ social construct” of gender, choosing to believe in the “social construct” of race ect)
The idea that any of this is required by the confines of the material rarely if ever crosses their mind, in many cases due to their own inexperience with the limitations of the material (the stereotype “Champaign socialist” ect)
1/2
Cooper Powell
You actually have to have an argument for anyone to respond to, dumbass.
Logan Walker
2/2
It’s at its core an inability to understand a world exists outside the human consciousness
A literal stunting of maturity
Isaac Thomas
???
Is this an unironic thesis user or are you just shitposting??
What exactly justifies you holding the land you took by force anymore then the colonists who took it by force from you??
It’s all the same non-logic
If your just advocating in your own interest that’s fine but you can’t seriously think anyone with a different interest has any reason to se things your way, which would make talking about a pretty fuckin futile exorcise
Dylan Ramirez
So who is being painted bad here?
Everyone is demanding to "go back" from each other.
If it makes fun of "go back" argument, because it can be infinitely regressed, than the modern confederate is under flak too.