This concept, in my opinion, is the primary culprit for bad story telling in many anime/manga. Wouldn't you agree?

This concept, in my opinion, is the primary culprit for bad story telling in many anime/manga. Wouldn't you agree?

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No. 95% of manga and anime are simply bad.

>twists bad
no they're cool. that character you like is actually related to the god of the universe and was secretly the chosen one this whole time. that's hype af

SnKbaby's first shitty ending?

Yeah kids like to generalize and stereotype the few things they know as what happens every time.

Name some anime and manga you like that don't follow this story structure (that actually tells a story).

Twists can't be good if they don't compromise the climax. Add stuff on top of the existing stakes instead of turning your story into a massive bait and switch.

No I think the primary culprit for bad storytelling is over reliance on tropes, laziness and lack of creativity. People just look at succesful works and do exactly that, but worse

I think you anons are misunderstanding the structure. It doesn't mean twist, it means turning point/reversal/change of direction. It's not specific to asian storytelling, it's universal and has many names. Most of all stories follow this to some degree.

Often times they aren't twists though. In the west twists are generally simple enough to where they make sense, throw you off guard and give a certain thrill.

The Sixth sense for example, worked very well with how things are filmed to where the simple concept of "he's dead" changed your entire perspective.

In manga, there the twists are more or less elaborate misunderstandings that are often too complex for their own good and can take up too much time trying to thread them into the original plot. It also has a way of devaluing what came before.

I know it's already terrible shoenen shit but the worst example of this I've ever seen was the edolas arc of Fairy Tail, regarding the exceeds. It was like a step by step sequence of "well actually this happened" leading to the most mundane explanation that surmounted to "This was a nothing burger the whole time".

I couldn't list episodic series which would be cheating, but anything trying to sell a longer story is going to have this structure.
I can tell you that the ones I like tend to "do it right"

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>the standard 3 act structure is the primary culprit for bad storytelling
Maybe bad writers are the primary culprit for bad writing. And it doesn't take waiting for the ending to recognize that. Is the story being strung together by a bunch of nonsense mysteries with no payoff for 50+ chapters, while major plot points get sidelined and there's no consistent themes? Congratulations, you're reading a bad manga. Expect a bad ending.

By your own admission the problem is not with the structure then.

There's nothing wrong with a twist. The twist ruining all of the development, on the other hand, is a common mistake.

Stop reading Isekai and Shonenshit where the author pulls shit out of his ass after 500 chapters.
This

I'm saying the insistence on the twist needing to be there leads to bad story telling, not that it was impossible to write a good story with it.

Twist only means "unexpected development" in this context. Not necessarily a "it was me all along/the whole show was a dream" type of thing. Anything where the hero experiences a setback for example is an unexpected development, and is used to create drama and tension. You're just misunderstanding what the structure represents.

If you think the insistence of twists is the problem, then go ahead and argue that. But what you posted was not that.

You literally described one piece

Most twists aren't even bad. Most bitching comes from normalfags or autists who expected to know the ending from the beginning and get mad when it doesn't play out to their liking.

He described every long-running shonen manga.

yes but this is the one that lives rent free

>This concept, in my opinion, is the primary culprit for bad story telling in many anime/manga. Wouldn't you agree?
No, just the opposite, its the culprit for all the best storytelling in manga and anime.

Half of modern anime and manga has no fucking development so, I would start there

And yet it's still better than anything western

Lowest common denominator retards are so bad now that I honestly cannot tell if this is shitposting or unironic.

I fucking hate this image because it makes you think the ten means twist in the way we think of twists. It's just referring to the point of irreversible change in a story. At some point the story turns its development into release, that's ten. It doesn't have to mean there's some gimmick fucking twist

No, I think the culprit for bad storytelling in anime and manga are bad writers. Fuck off.

He said 50 chapters not 5000

The problem is when an author sees this and takes it way too literally like what Darling in the Franxx did. Some conflict is okay, but lately most anime and manga seem to cobble a rushed conclusion after wasting months in "development" that isn't anything but MC wanking, of course it's going to look like an asspull, because it cleaerly is one.

This. Unironically. how many times have I seen niggers butthurt that their so-epic theory turned out to be wrong and now out of principle, they shit on the actual twist?

A story with a shit twist is still better than a story without any surprises and twists.

i think any concept , flow chart or idea or whatever can be made into a compelling even incredible story . beyond usual problems like a repetitive formula that showed just enough success and is made the standard because of money seems to me to be the culprit in every corner of the world . atleast until the mold is broken again by something new or something old that is sold as new or a new combination of multiple things .

Character interactions and atmosphere are more important variables to make a good story