Nice democracy you've got in there, shitrope

Please tell me where I have told falsehoods.

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The threatment of average Russian citizen, who had no say in the war, by Europeans got quite a lot of attention on Turkey interestingly enough.
I think many Turks share similar opinions with Russians on this matter, that the veneer of european tolerance and civilization and democracy is very thin.

чeмoдaн вoкзaл пoдвaл CБУ

>by Europeans got quite a lot of attention on Turkey interestingly enough.

Well, if you are afraid that Turks will be treated the same way if Erdogan starts some stupid war against Greece then yes, you can expect this.

I hate what Russia has become, but, if I were in this situation, I'd tell them to go fuck themselves. I won't prostrate myself just because someone wants me to.

the joke here is, If we get attacked by anyone Europeans would sanction us instead.

Isn't that ironic however, I mean Erdogan and Putin are authoritarian leaders no? Why on earth you punish the people who have little to no say in the government?
Yeah they voted for them in faux elections and I'm not one of those duginist schizos who shit on europe all the time. But I find collective punishment of an entire people to be a bit weird and dare I say nazi-ish.

Europe protects its interests same way Turkey does it to its interests. Why do you still demand that Pakistani citizens need to go through long, hard and humiliating procedure to obtain Turkish visa and still a lot of them are denied it? It's undemocratic and unislamic yet you don't care.

> Why on earth you punish the people who have little to no say in the government?

The whole point is to make people angry at their government so they start protesting and eventually topple the authoritarian government. Sometimes works, sometimes does not.

>the joke here is, If we get attacked by anyone Europeans would sanction us instead.

You weren't sanctioned for starting the whole mess in Syria somehow.

bait thread

I mean I'm not a muslim but I do care about treatment of minorities and syrians and everyone and I would be the first one to say Turkey has far more human rights violations etc than the average european country. But collective punishment of an entire citizen body just because of their leader is a bit absurd. Especially in an authoratarian society.
If Russia was more democratic one might have argued that average Russian is responsible. I might even consneed that even authoritarian governments govern by some degree of consent.
>The whole point is to make people angry at their government so they start protesting and eventually topple the authoritarian government.
Sanctions may work as such but I think some actions are basically collective punishment.
Yeah thats because we have Refugees. Which is a shame. Europe was always a good influence for Turkey until recently, Erdogan has Europe by the balls. And europe would rather have an islamic shithole that keeps refugees than a secular modern nation that kicks them out but that is for another topic.

I think you overestimate Europe's strength.

I can understand the narrow group of educated, secular Turks may view themselves European and get angry that Europe rejects them but well, most of Turks are conservative and don't even feel European. They simply like Erdogan.

I mean most boomers do like him. Erdoğan was never popular in the minus 40 crowd so that would change. The rhetoric of erdoğan representing the silenced majority is over now. apparently he was just representing one demography and with them dying and new demography coming forward Turkey will swing back.

I understand that every nation even the most authoritarian one is ruled by consent but I feel average clueless chump should not be harshly punished. But maybe you are right and this is just a move out of panic.