Why hasn’t Marvel had its Watchmen
Why hasn’t Marvel had its Watchmen
Kayden Foster
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Adam Ross
Its Watchmen is better than Watchmen.
Alexander Ross
Because DC and Marvel are actually pretty fundamentally different but fags go ‘they both do funny books with folks in long underwear’ so assume they’re the exact same.
Mason Adams
Weird thing about Marvel is that they've almost never made anything that made a big stir in the medium, not the way that DKR, Watchmen, Crisis, or others have.
Closest you'll find to Watchmen is The One.
Adrian Morris
What's The One?
Henry Morris
What about Marvels? Or OG Spiderman run?
Parker Diaz
>are actually pretty fundamentally different
not really, no
Eli Stewart
Not much point I think. Marvel kinda fucks things up constantly. I'd argue that Watchmen makes more sense for DC. Taking a Bruce Wayne/Ted Kord allegory and turning him into a sort of pathetic rich loser was refreshing for the time. On the other hand, what are you gonna do with an allegory for Tony Stark? Turn him into even MORE of an alcoholic? Make him fuck up even MORE than he already has? Or here's a fresh one, make a Spider-Man who's even WORSE at balancing his private life and superhero life and fucks both up due to his inability to commit to either! Because that's surely an idea no one's ever had before!
Thing is DC was always more idealistic and optimistic than Marvel. Of course it's not like DC superheroes don't fuck up constantly, just look at Batman's career in the 90s. He did nothing BUT fuck up constantly during that era. But the difference between Batman and Iron Man was that Batman spent most of the Golden and Silver Age being an upstanding, righteous and heroic individual, one of the two pillars of the DC universe. Iron Man, however, was always an alcoholic.
Nicholas Ramirez
Ok, with a theoretical Marvel watchmen, there would be a few questions:
>Which heroes would the cast be riffing on?
>Which archetypes in general would the cast be riffing on?
>What's the subversive political critique in it?
It'd be easy enough to say "Just do watchmen with Marvel archetypes instead" but that would change the whole dynamic of the group and ultimately the plot itself.
Jason Ward
Also, Marvel kind of already had its own Watchmen. It's called Ultimatum.
Luke Adams
They are really not
Aaron Harris
Marvels?
Josiah Reyes
DC has Time magazine as an in-house publication of Time warner to hype up the usual suspects of Watchmen/Dark Knight Returns/Year One for decades.
Marvel's always specialized in runs, but its harder to push those in magazines, especially since trades weren't able to cover hundreds of issues and stay in circulation. That's a large part why comic shops sprung into existence.
Lincoln Stewart
What would the Watchmen equivalent to Kamen Rider be?
Andrew Brooks
Marvels is more equivalent to Kingdom Come.
Chase White
Marvel tried and failed in the 80's. Jim Shooter pushed for high quality, creator driven content. He got chased out by jealous co-workers who just wanted the same slop they had when they were kids. In the 90's Marvel was chasing big merch by exploiting IPs. Toys, cartoons, movies, cereals, flamethrowers! The Image Comics revolt wasn't because Marvel wouldn't let them make good comics, it was because they figured if Marvel can make shit that people lap up, why not get 100% of the profit? Joe Quesada tried again with Marvel Knights and Marvel MAX but again, seething fanboys couldn't handle it and now suits were nervous the IPs might be damaged.
Tyler Mitchell
Skull Man
Devil Man
Kamen Rider Amazons
user nearly half of all the most popular manga from the 60s and 70s were basically Japanese Watchmen.
Jonathan Gray
Xavier Garcia
I think the generalised answer is DC have had some great limited series and Marvel has had some great runs. Now people will bring up exceptions, which obviously exist, but it does feel like this is the right answer. To be even more generalised I think the whole "Marvel is about humans trying to play God; DC is about Gods trying to be more human," thing kind of fits too, the "realism" aspect of Marvel comics and the whole "world outside your window" is what helped early Marvel. We are using the New York we know, not Gotham; Spider-Man has to worry about lady problems and money. So applying that style to DC is what Watchmen is where as the main Marvel universe has always had the sort of real life pressures, maybe not the real life psychology though, like is displayed in Watchmen.
Jack Roberts
eh right sentiment but wrong chose of character
Tony Stark in the 80s and 90s wasn't an ass and was very honest & chill (he even reform villains like Vanko) with his faults just being absolutely fear of his technology hurting others and while the alcoholic was invented not many people know that his issue was relegated to a back ground issue in "demon in the bottle" it why it such a big deal as him going down the spiral began insignificant at the beginning and intensify later on.
it was not until civil war in 2000s where writer just made him a stand in for their issues for the Bush administration and later on evolve into MCU douche bag tony. It at the point where like all the other Illuminati are just absolute immoral ass who simply think they can rule the world because their "smart" & smelling their own farts compassion & morality be dammed and the only one who acknowledge how much of a monster they are is Namor of all fucking people
A Watchman book can be done if they actual show how much the illuminati fail due their pseudo intellectual self righteous pragmatic views which is something Hickman did in his book
Nicholas Allen
Probably whatever the hell Anno is making
Christopher Allen
What's DC equivalent to Kamen Rider
William Taylor
>Crisis
You mean the Secret Wars ripoff? For better or worse Shooter Marvel invented the event comic.
Logan Long
This is trash compared to Watchmen.
No. These are merely "dark and mature".
Watchmen is more than that.
I'd really like a Japanese Watchmen, but as with Marvel, I don't think the right ingredients, situation, and environment could be put in place at this point.
Thomas Parker
I don't think a Watchmen style book would help Marvel all that much at this point. Because all it would do is merely show the natural and expected consequences of the heroes' incompetence. The Marvel universe should be burnt to the ground at this point, but it's not because the world is never forced to deal with the consequences of the heroes' mistakes and actions, or if they are, those consequences are often severely underplayed.
Now, if a series that was A) made and B) made competently, it would just point of the flaws of Marvel as a whole. The original intentions of Watchmen were partially to criticize the Dark Age of comics and ridicule the idea of superheroes as realistic superheroes. At the very least, this was one of Moore's intentions. He was criticizing shit like The Dark Knight Returns. He failed in this endeavor and in fact Watchmen ended up becoming one of the principle factors for the increasing darkening of comic superheroes.
Charles Jenkins
I mean there is probably a lot of Japanese works that turns the entire genre on its' head through clever subversion and understanding of their own medium.
Matthew Wright
In terms of events, I'd say you're right, but Miller's (written) Daredevil and Kraven's Last Hunt come to mind for must-read stories to me.